Talk:Lighthouse

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Light or Lighthouse

I am confused. Does the phrase 'Light' refer to the actual light source or the entire lighthouse. There is some ambiguity in this article (and many other light/lighthouse articles) regarding this strange way of phrasing things. For instance, Tillamook Rock Light refers to itself as a lighthouse in the article, and there are even references to 'Tillamook Rock Lighthouse'. Can someone elaborate on this? 24.17.190.28 (talk) 02:04, 20 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

To add to this, I present an excerpt---Where a tall cliff exists, a smaller structure may be placed on top such as at Horton Point Light. Sometimes, such a location can be too high – as along the west coast of the United States. In these cases, lights are placed below clifftop to ensure that they can still be seen at the surface during periods of fog, as at Point Reyes Lighthouse. Another victim of fog was Point Loma Light (old) which was replaced with a lower light, Point Loma Light (new).24.17.190.28 (talk) 02:09, 20 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

There, the phrase 'Light' is referring to the entire lighthouse. The ambiguity comes from the way different bodies refer to them. I'll adjust those parts so they're clear. –Whitehorse1 14:40, 28 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

when the house was created in the late 18th century they were not sure if they could reuse it.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.70.92.110 (talk) 13:33, 8 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Photos

Curious-- maybe this isn't germane, but the picture NantucketRangeLites.jpg has the flag of Washington DC flying on the right side. Is this distracting? Does this make viewers question its authenticity? Like I said, might not be relevant or important, but it does seem... at least.. curious. Treat Whambin (talk) 00:47, 11 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Photos on this page should only be those needed to illustrate a point in the written narative of this introductory article. Everyone has their own favorite lighhouse and photo. Good! Then create a separate article about that particular lighthouse and add your photo there, not here. Thanks! GCW50 (talk) 18:57, 22 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Also, the page is missing a photo of a medieval lighthouse, my suggestion Kõpu lighthouse, but I don't want to be the one adding his "favourite" here, so I'm leaving this to someone else. H2ppyme (talk) 18:07, 16 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Added it anyway, since noone responded. H2ppyme (talk) 21:26, 21 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

That's fine as it is historically significant and we didn't have one from that era. 04:57, 31 January 2008 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by GCW50 (talk • contribs)

Manned Lighthouses

Could someone give a reference to a manned lighthouse, if there are any? I have heard from several sources that none remain, so some concrete reference for the claim that "a few" are still manned would be nice. --Andrew 07:09, 6 Jun 2004 (UTC)

I believe that at this point, all lighthouses are electrified and automated. That doesn't mean there are not people around. In many cases, the lighthouse is at the site of a Coast Guard (US term, but equivalent in other nations) stations, so I guess they are "manned" and in some nations "womened". Even with a fully electrified, solar powered light, the bulbs need replacement. Most have automated facilities to replace a burned out bulb, but at least once a year somebody needs to replenish the "cartridge" of spare bulbs. Charles W. Bash 21:58, 19 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

These two sentences contradict each other in that regard:

Improvements in maritime navigation and safety such as GPS have led to the phasing out of non-automated lighthouses, with the last keepers removed in the 1990s.

Today there are a few keeper-run lighthouses left in existence; the vast majority have been fully automated.

Either they were removed in the 1990s, or not. Billy H 00:00, 22 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

There are no manned lighthouses with a permanent keeper employed by a navigation service such as USCG. The last in the US was Boston Light. A few preservation societies have "keepers" to look after the buldings in their care, conduct tours, offer B&B overnight stays, etc. but they are not responsible for the light itself. These are serviced by visiting USCG ANT teams in the US. The article has been updated GCW50 18:47, 15 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

What about the Cordouan lighthouse in France? it is manned and has the first Fresnel lens ever installed. it is also one of the oldest lighthouse still in use. the base and the first 3 floors of the current building go back to the Renaissance.70.68.205.209 (talk) 04:05, 2 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I just uploaded a photo of the lens at the Cape Meares Lighthouse, but I don't know what kind of lens it is so I don't know where to put it (other than in the article on the lighthouse itself, but I thought it would be more useful as a lens example). Does someone know? Elf | Talk 03:27, 21 Jun 2004 (UTC)

It appears to be a first-order Fresnel lens; see [1], [2], [3], [4]. --Andrew 16:03, 22 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Thanks for the research; I put it on Fresnel lens. Elf | Talk 16:22, 22 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Screw-pile lighthouses, Keys lighthouses

I would like to have an article, or a section of this article, which describes the unusual lighthouses of screw-pile design. These lighthouse are constructed of cast iron, with iron pilings that are screwed into rock. Notable examples of this construction are the lights located several miles offshore on the edge of the reef along the Florida Keys in the U.S.

These structures include Carysfort Reef, Alligator Reef, and Sombrero Reef lights. They have stood for more than 100 years and survived intense hurricanes. They were manned for many years by Light Service employees who were isolated far from shore, living in small quarters within the framework of the towers.

Any suggestions about adding a section here or starting a new article? I can use the talk page to create a draft if anyone wants to see the content before deciding. Thanks for any feedback. DavidH 22:14, July 15, 2005 (UTC)

I suggest a seperate article, considering the main thing about them is their architecture, as opposed to their function (Although that has its hand in it). 68.39.174.238 04:46, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

too many images

There are too many images for the page to display without gaps in the text. Any suggestions as to which to remove? -- Samuel Wantman 01:52, 20 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I like the photos and see only one gap (after the intro) in my browser. Would like to see some other types, but wouldn't recommend removing any just to improve the layout, looks pretty good to me. DavidH 03:25, July 20, 2005 (UTC)

I rearranged to fix the gap problems. -- Samuel Wantman 20:36, 1 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The first image, the "Traditional Lighthouse" is a beautiful image but it is riddled with jpeg artifacts. CWPappas 08:00, 24 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think that an HDR image is appropriate for a reference article. It's a nice picture, but it's artificial. Goingstuckey 19:05, 8 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Replaced it with a real lighthouse (Eddystone light, one of the truly ground breaking wavewashed light houses) and moved all the of the excessive pictures to their own gallery page. I also eliminated the "Notable lighthouses" section and moved appropriate ones to the various sections to illustrate concepts. By design, every lighthouse is designed to be "notable"! This is an encylcopedia, not a top ten list. GCW50 18:39, 15 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Created a gallery for images relating to Fresnel lens and the mechanisms that run them. Moved Fresnel_lens_loschen_hg.jpg to gallery to keep it from competing with lighthouse images. Removed Pigeon_Point_Light_house.jpg as it did not seem to add much value to the article.Mnhs (talk) 06:08, 15 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Lighthouses are very photogenic, but dozens of images don't serve much encyclopediac purpose. Unless there's some notable quality illustrated by an image, I'd rather not have it added to a huge gallery. --Wtshymanski (talk) 17:14, 8 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

concentration of light text

This is confusing to me, and leaves out some important detail:

In order to conserve power, the light is concentrated. In old lighthouses:

vertically the light is bundled into horizontal directions
horizontally the light is bundled into one or a few directions at a time, but sweeping around, so that it can be observed from every horizontal direction

"Bundled" seems a strange adjective for light concentration. Also, many lights in the US at least have specific angular regions of visibilty and on/off patterns -- so the part about "sweeping around" doesn't apply in all cases. It does refer to "old" lighthouses, but many are old and don't operate this way. Maybe it should be "in the past." Actually, a section on actual light appearance in regard to navigation should probably be expanded. Comments? DavidH 18:28, August 1, 2005 (UTC)

reworded it. GCW50 18:40, 15 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Navigation using multiple lights

Correct me if I'm wrong but don't some lighthouses have an additional light (eg. Red) that flashes once per revolution when the main light is aligned with North?

I haven't come across this in any of my voyages. Has anyone else? GCW50 18:41, 15 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Inland Lighthouses

Not all lighthouses are built on coastal waters. The landlocked, freshwater lake Cobbosseeconte in Manchester, Maine has a small but important lighthouse constructed on a reef island to alert boaters of the hazardous rocks. New Hampshire and Vermont also have inland lighthouses. These lighthouses are not owned by the Coast Guard but by Yacht clubs and historical/preservational societies.

Inland lighthouses are certainly germaine (such as those on the Great Lakes or Lake Champlain). But private aids to navigation that have not been approved by the Coast Guard and placed on their "Light List" are generally considered not to be true lighthouses. See www.ARLHS.com for the common standard in determining real lighthouses versus decorations. GCW50 18:35, 15 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

RTGs

I replaced, " The Soviet Union built a number of automated lighthouses powered by radioisotope thermoelectric generators. These now pose serious concerns, as the radioactive material could leak, leading to radioactive contamination, or be stolen and used in a dirty bomb (see Bellona's report). Some of these lighthouses cannot be found, due to poor record keeping." with, " The Soviet Union built a number of automated lighthouses powered by radioisotope thermoelectric generators. Supporters of powering lighthouses this way point out that they can operate for very long periods of time without external support, that they are very reliable, and that the strontium 90 in the RTGs comes from nuclear waste [5]. Critics argue that they are potentially dangerous, as the radioactive material could leak, leading to radioactive contamination, or be stolen and used in a dirty bomb (according to Bellona's report). Some of these lighthouses cannot be found, due to poor record keeping. While many have security concerns over this, it shows that the lighthouses are very reliable." The previous version was opposed to RTG lighthouses, while the current version states claimed advantages, claimed disadvantages, and states the opinions of RTG supporters ( like AEI). Polonium 22:04, 20 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Why is there no mention of La Torre de Hercules in La Coruna, in Spain. It is the oldest Roman lighthouse still in operation today?

Feel free to start a separate article on it. GCW50 18:42, 15 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The article at Tower of Hercules appears to have been started in January of 2005. 67.86.73.252 (talk) 22:21, 2 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Point Lookout Lighthouse

Maryland's Point Lookout Light was investigated for paranormal activity by Dr. Hans Holzer in the late 1970's. Several recordings were made and one photograph seems to show an apparition of a Civil War soldier. The lighthouse is immediately adjacent to a park which was used as military barracks and prison during the war. Additionally, numerous shipwrecks occurred nearby. This history seems unique, and I wonder if it qualifies for mention in this article? Patriotick 06:47, 12 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

add it to the Point Lookout Lighthouse article itself.GCW50 19:30, 26 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

A Coruña is not a Mediterranean town

I did a little change since the article was confuse about it. It is true that most of the Roman lighthouses in use in Middle Ages were at Mediterranean Sea, but A Coruña is in the very Atlantic Ocean.212.51.52.5 17:51, 18 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! GCW50 08:41, 19 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

New London vs. Saybrook Breakwater on CT license plate

This article claims that New London Harbor Light is on a license plate, but the article on Saybrook Breakwater Light claims it is depicted on the Connecticut state license plates (and I doubt that another state or country would put a depiction of the New London light on their license plates). There are visitor plaques in the vicinity of the Saybrook light that also assert it is the one that appears on the Connecticut license plates and the design difference between the lighthouses implies to me that the claim is accurate (I have seen Connecticut license plates and I have seen the Saybrook Breakwater light. I have only seen the New London light at dusk though, but the 1907 picture postcard at the New London Harbor Light article has me convinced it does not appear on the CT issued license plates). Note too that the New London light lies near the mouth of the smaller Thames River compared to the Saybrook light at the mouth of the much larger Connecticut River (from which the state derives its name). The footnote for the sentence in the article leads to a south Mississippi Sun Herald newspaper article that is apparently no longer archived on that newspaper's web server in my visit today (9 April 2008). I speculate that a newspaper reporter in Gulfport, Mississippi may not have carefully distinguished between a lighthouse in New London, Connecticut and one in Old Saybrook, Connecticut. Would anyone object to swapping in Saybrook Breakwater Light to take the place of New London Harbor Light in the "Popular culture and symbolism" section for this article? I could add a ref footnote to the separate article on the Saybrook light to back up the claim for verifiability's sake. 164.55.254.106 (talk) 18:00, 9 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Feel free to change it if you think it's more accurate. Unfortunately the CT DMV site doesn't say what lighthouse it is [6]

GCW50 (talk) 10:15, 17 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The change has been made. 164.55.254.106 (talk) 18:53, 18 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

how do lighthousesensors work? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.137.17.119 (talk) 10:49, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Definition

I would suggest rearranging the wording of the definition of a lighthouse. It currently says "A lighthouse is a tower, building, or framework designed to emit light from a system of lamps and lenses or, in older times, from a fire and used as an aid to navigation and to pilots at sea."

That puts the emphasis too much on the structure. My proposal (which I put here rather than a direct edit intentionally) is

"A lighthouse is a framework designed to emit light used as an aid to navigation and to pilots at sea. The source of light has varied from a simple fire (in the earliest times) to a system of lamps combined with systems of lenses intended to make the light visible from long distances away from the source of the light. At many times in history, these structures were constructed as a tower connected to a structure intended to support the staff for long periods significantly removed from other civilizations, thus the combined words 'light' + 'house'. In current times, the only permanent staffing remains at sites which are combined with other services (thus in the US, with a Coast Guard Station)."

Charles W. Bash (talk) 16:02, 6 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I'm mixed. Most women I know don't care much about the light or navigational purpose: for them, it's about the unique structure, desolation, isolation, and beauty of the site—though I realize not all lighthouses are on the Oregon Coast. If the language were to be revised, I suggest something which succinctly captures the site as a potential long-term home for a family. —EncMstr (talk) 18:27, 6 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I also disagree personally with the definition of lighthouse here. I don't necessarily think that the definition should be linked very closely with a (regular) house but a metal tower to me in no way should be called a lighthouse. eg. the Point Arguello Light (modern) is still used as a navigational aid, but it's no longer any sort of house by almost anyone's definition. Similarly, towers that are cylindrical and have no attached living quarters are considered a lighthouse by most, eg. Point Arena. I would love some source that spelled it out as such but it's doubtful. Sudopeople (talk) 19:06, 10 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Links chapter

I suggest to add one more link to the link chapter - to site www.lightphotos.net. This is valuable resource for people who'll be interesting in lighthouses. At the moment it contains information about 3000 lights world wide (more than 100 countries) with detailed info/photos/historical data for each and this number is growing every month. All photos structured by country, tagged and could be seen on google maps. I think you can find only 2-3 such resources in whole web. Full text of link could be:

World of Lighthouses website Worldwide database of lighthouses and navigational lights, containing photos, geo-location and other detailed information for each and providing extended search functions among the data.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.100.165.195 (talk • contribs)

I removed that link when it was added a few days ago. It is a image sharing site, requiring registration to upload or download images. I believe that the site falls under the category of "Links normally to be avoided" in Wikipedia:External links. -- Donald Albury 19:43, 7 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Donald, full content of site available without registration (except of uploading of the images and downloading of full size images (intermediate size images are available)). Site content is not only in images, but also detailed information about each light: official number, coordinates, type of light, range, elevation, year and construction info, if available. Every image is going through strict moderation queue, so information on site is double checked by uploader and site moderator. As the result accuracy of data, i believe, better than on sites presented in other links. Therefore, in my opinion this site is comply to requirement: "Sites that contain neutral and accurate material that is relevant to an encyclopedic understanding of the subject" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.100.169.218 (talk) 08:05, 8 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

You missed out the second part of the sentence that you quoted from WP:EL: "…and cannot be integrated into the Wikipedia article due to copyright issues, amount of detail (such as professional athlete statistics, movie or television credits, interview transcripts, or online textbooks), or other reasons." I don't see anything on your website that either is not already in Wikipedia or could not be added to Wikipedia.—Jeremy (talk) 13:22, 8 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

what's about "amount of detail" - admiralty list of lights contain 70000 lights around the world. 99% of them will never appear in wikipedia, only in specialized sites. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.122.91.161 (talk) 19:33, 8 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

You might want to try checking what we have: Category:Lighthouses by country. Granted I've not looked at a lot; but in every area of the world that I have compared so far WIkipedia provides greater breadth and depth of coverage than your website.—Jeremy (talk) 21:10, 8 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Source One

Source One is not an acceptable source for lighthouses, the reference is a book directed at casual readers and has little to no scholarly value. — Preceding unsigned comment added by TheLionHearted (talk • contribs) 20:11, 25 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Lighthouse lamps

There are two sections that discuss the lamps used in lighthouses - one under History called 'Lighting improvements' and one under Lighthouse technology caller 'Power'. The first one ends up briefly mentioning that that electric lighting became dominant in the 1960s and the second one doesn't mention electric light at all. First of all, couldn't these two sections be combined? Secondly, what type and power of lamp is used today? According to this xenon lamps are used in many lighthouses - which suggests that they are not always used. . Richerman (talk) 16:48, 2 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Mention how much electricity lighthouses use

Mention watts, power use and bills. Not just e.g., lumens, etc. Jidanni (talk) 11:28, 13 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Lighthouse utility bills are problematic. I don't know of any sourcing for any of the local lighthouses and for the few lights I have toured, they don't seem to be a consideration. And if they light is sometimes solar or generator powered, it would be so hard to account for cost I doubt few installations do it.

I agree, the type of light source and power level would be interesting, particularly if it has recently changed to a more efficient solution. —EncMstr (talk) 00:10, 14 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

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Swedish film about lighthouse from 2000

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0238237/ Title: Fyren Dir: Kristian Petri 121.75.12.18 (talk) 02:28, 10 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

Kapu Beach Lighthouse .jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 08:37, 31 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Range formula

The design section gives a formula for the distance at which a light house is visible ( $d=1.17{\sqrt {H}}$ nautical miles where H is in feet). Even ignoring the fact that this doesn't account for the height of the observer, this formula — which is quoted from a now-defunct "BoatSafeKids" page (archived) which stated this formula without source or derivation (but did address height of observer) — seems to be incorrect. A quick sketch of the situation and applying pythagoras shows that $d^{2}=(R+H)^{2}-R^{2}=H^{2}+2RH$ (where R is the Earth radius). Since H is tiny compared to R, the $H^{2}$ term is negligible hence $d\approx {\sqrt {2RH}}$ . Filling in R and adjusting units of H and d to feet and nautical miles respectively gives $d\approx {\sqrt {2\cdot (6378100{\text{ m}})\cdot H\cdot (0.3048{\text{ m/ft}})}}/(1852{\text{ m/nmi}})\approx 1.0647{\sqrt {H}}$ . xmath (talk) 12:50, 23 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Per Wikipedia:Verifiability and Wikipedia:No original research, it is fine to cite a visible range for a navigational light when it is supported by a citation to a reliable source, but, in my opinion, it would be a violation of NOR to calculate a range using a formula. - Donald Albury 13:10, 23 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Removed gallery

I removed the Gallery section that was just added as unnecessary. This article is well illustrated, and does not need more pictures of lighthouses. The List of lighthouses in... series of articles provides ample scope for images (no more than one each) of individual lighthouses, while multiple images of a lighthouse may be appropriate in the article about that lighthouse. Per the policy at Wikipedia:Image use policy#Adding images to articles, "The purpose of an image is to increase readers' understanding of the article's subject matter, usually by directly depicting people, things, activities, and concepts described in the article. The relevant aspect of the image should be clear and central." Images in this article should be used only to illustrates particular important facts about lighthouses, and not for decorative or promotional purposes. - Donald Albury 13:34, 9 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

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Something looks wrong on the first bullet point on the 'See also' section

Something looks wrong on the first bullet point (the bit containing the #) on the 'See also' section but I don't want to mess with it in case it breaks the link. Xboxsponge15 (talk) 09:52, 25 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

That was just a link to the "Lighthouse lens sizes" section in the "Fresnel lens" article. I piped the link to simplify the display. - Donald Albury 17:57, 25 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Notable medieval lighthouse

This page used to have a photo of the Kõpu lighthouse, probably the most notable medieval lighthouse there is. It was removed because it was "not notable", but it sure seems a lot more notable than many other lighthouses that have photos shown on the article. H2ppyme (talk) 12:15, 1 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The Kõpu lighthouse has been modified, so I would say there is a question of how well the image used in its article represents the medieval structure. - Donald Albury 15:13, 1 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]